Help me identify a dialect!

Latest post Mon, Jun 27 2011 10:37 by Loco. 7 replies.
  • Tue, Jan 18 2011 13:52

    • tentaclezoom
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    Help me identify a dialect!

    I've been watching lots of Irish TV lately and there is a certainly dialect that I hear occasionally and am fascinated by, but I am having trouble identifying it and was wondering if anyone from Ireland could offer their expertise.

    If you fast forward to about the 3:00 minute mark, a man begins to talk and that's the dialect I'm wondering about. A few things I notice about pronunciation are saying dhéanamh as "yay-noo" and orm as "ahhhrim." This is the dialect I want to shape my pronunciation around, it sounds lovely to me!

    http://live.tg4.ie/main.aspx?level=CursaiReatha&content=436321216513

    Go raibh míle maith agat,
    Brittany

    (Or if anyone is familiar with Ros na Rún, it is also the dialect that John Joe's daughter has - I thought she might be from Dublin, but I'm American and I have no idea, lol).

     

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  • Tue, Jan 18 2011 16:00 In reply to

    • seano
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    Hi Brittany, This is Liam Ó Cuinneagáin, who is a Donegal speaker. The girl who speaks just after him is also a Donegal speaker. Donegal dialect (which is the dialect I speak) shares many features with Scottish Gaelic, both in grammar and pronunciation. It is very soft in comparison with some of the other dialects - many of the sounds are enunciated in the front of the mouth rather than in the back of the throat. For example the word theacht in southern dialects has a very strong ch sound made in the back of the throat, almost like somebody clearing their throat to spit, but in Donegal, many speakers say it almost like the word thart. I prefer it to the other dialects but I'm biased. All the dialects are beautiful and all of them are worth learning, but if this is the speaker you like the sound of, then Ulster Irish or Donegal Irish is the dialect for you. Big Smile

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  • Tue, Jan 18 2011 18:51 In reply to

    • tentaclezoom
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    Thank you! Donegal was my second guess after the Dublin area, so I was close. :) That is definitely the dialect I wish to practice. The stress placed on certain syllables sounds so melodious.

    If you have any other tips that are distinct to Donegal Irish I'd very much appreciate it.

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  • Tue, Jan 18 2011 19:42 In reply to

    • seano
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    Where do I start? You are doing the right thing by getting hold of samples of the language and listening to them, but here are a few pointers. I think some of them have already been mentioned here but it doesn't hurt to say them again!

    The main difference is that the stress usually falls on the first syllable in Ulster, and there is a tendency for vowels which aren't in the first syllable to become that blurry indistinct mid-vowel which linguists call a schwa. Thus the word for salmon, bradán, is pronounced BRADDun in Ulster. In southern dialects where the stress is on another syllable, it's often something like burDAWN. The word for bottle, buidéal, is usually BWIDJul to us, but bwidALE to a southerner.

    The vowels are generally different. An o will frequently sound more like an a. Thus ina chodladh (asleep) would be ina holla in most dialects but almost ina halla in Donegal. The á is a very different sound in Donegal. In the south it's an aw, but in the north it's somewhere between an ah and an eh. The ú of words like tú or lú is very rounded in Donegal - almost the way a French speaker does a u.

    The main difference with consonants is probably the way a bh and an mh are often pronounced as w rather than v. In the south they're nearly always v. In Ulster Irish, it's v when slender (that is, next to an i or an e), so these are all v sounds: bhean, mhír, bhí, mhíolta, bheannaithe, bheannaigh, mhill, mheall, bhinn, bhéal. It's also a v when there is an r or an l or an n next to a bh or mh, as in: bhris, bhréag, bhrí, bhriathar, mhná. The rest of the time, in Ulster, these are like a w. So bhuí, bhog, bhfuair, bhain, mhór, mharaigh, mharbh, mhaol, mharcáil are all with a w sound.

    Another difference is the slender d of déanamh, díreach, dian. This is more like an English j than in the other dialects, though not exactly the same. And the slender r is sometimes pronounced like a y and sometimes a bit like a z. It's a strange sound. See if you can pick any out from T na G!

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  • Fri, Jan 21 2011 17:26 In reply to

    • tentaclezoom
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    Arís, go raibh míle maith agat.

    I can hear all these things when I listen to the dialect, but I don't always think to use them in my own speech until it is spelled out for me. For example, I can always hear the rounded ú sound, but until you said "rounded" I wasn't sure why I didn't sound the same. Now that's one thing fixed.

    I'm sure I will have more questions soon so stick around! ;)

     

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  • Mon, Jan 24 2011 8:34 In reply to

    • seano
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    Ná habair é! (Don't mention it!) Anyway, as I have said here before, the facial expression you use when you speak a language actually influences how good your accent is. A French speaker uses the facial muscles in a very different way from an English speaker, or a Yiddish speaker, or a Spanish speaker. Keep the questions coming, anyway! 

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  • Fri, Jun 24 2011 8:18 In reply to

    • sasik
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    The term dialect is used in two distinct ways, even by linguists. One usage refers to a variety of a language that is a characteristic of a particular group of the language's speakers. The term is applied most often to regional speech patterns, but a dialect may also be defined by other factors, such as social class.

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  • Mon, Jun 27 2011 10:37 In reply to

    • Loco
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    Re: Help me identify a dialect!

    As a non-Irish Gaelic learner it's lovely to hear the different accents and dialects, fascinating... but also confusing.. which one do I choose to use? In my little Irish group we have speakers from all over so I'm exposed to a real variety of ways of pronouncing things, and also the actual words which are used! I'm not complaining - it's great!

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