starting to learn

A Bhrittany:

Níl fadbh.  Email me later and if you have Skype we can have a 30 minute or so chat and I'll try to relate to you what I know and don't know and give you some pointers.  I have had a tutor who is a native speaker for the last few months.  She is 80 miles away so I could only go see her once per week.  I will attend her course next semester.  She is a Professor of Irish studies and St. Thomas University in Houston. If you send me your email address to  fabermcmullen@gmail.com  I will send you a course that I created last Spring and taught 6 or 7 homeschoolers here some beginner's Irish.

I look forward to speaking with you soon.   

Slán go foill,

Faber

Hi to all! I am newbie here and that's my first post on this forum. I never learned Irish (as well as other Celtic languages), wish to try, and I am, to my shame, afwully scared. No doubt each new language is abit like a new Universe, and I feel myself as an astronaut landing on Mars (or maybe even queerer). I live in Russia, speak English, know some Arabic, German and Old Slavic, and can say a couple of words in Japanese, Mandarin, Turkish and Latin. Maybe this luggage will be enough to begin my aquaintance with Irish, I wonder...

Dear Gaurung:

I do not know if those other languages will help you at all.  Irish is a celtic language and is very different from all other European

languages that I have studied.  I have studied diligently for 12 months (been at it for almost two years off and on), and it just

now is becoming familiar to me in different ways.  The main difference that I can see is that many predicate thoughts are constructed

through using Prepositional Pronouns (there are probably over 100).  For example there is no verb "to have".  Therefore, in Irish we

say that "something is at me, or somethings is at you".  For example:  Tá airgead agam.  Tá airgead agat.  These carry the meanings: 

I have money.  You have money.  They are literally:  It is money at me.  It is money at you.   I wish you luck and think it is wonderful

that you have an interest in the Irish Language.  It is an interesting language and is one of the oldest languages or European people.

Slán go foill  (goodbye for a while)

Faber McMullen

Wow that's amazing how similiar in some ways can be absolutely different languages, so far from each other historically and geographically! Just the same situation you can see in Arabic -- there're no constructions with verb "to have", but there's a construction with preposition "at, with" -- "3andee fuluus", "3anduka fuluus" -- "at+me money", "at+you money". I wonder why.
Anyway, go raibh maith agat for your kind words!

I am not sure why these constructions came about, you'll see many such things in Irish.  You should get something called the "glance card".  It has been the single most helpful resource for me as I am learning.  It is only about $5.  If you have no way to order it, I can send you one put together by a study group in Dallas, Texas.  You can email me at fabermcmullen@gmail.com

Adh mór, agus tá súil agam go bhuil tú go maith i do shtaidear i nGaeilge, (literally:  Luck big, and is (an) eye at me that is very good in your study in Gaelic)  or, as we would normally say, " Good luck, and I hope that you go well in your Gaeilc study"

Faber

For people starting out there are 2 IRC chat rooms where you can practise your share of irish or read the other peoples convo, just to get you practising your writing and speed of thought through Irish

http://wbe04.mibbit.com/?settings=a4dd853e61ef8f1080c6aebbb88553db&server=irc.mibbit.net&channel=%23Gaeilge

http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=gaeilge

Go n-éirí libh

Faber,

I'm pretty new at this game, but have been making some slow progress.  I am interested primarily in Ulster Irish, and have tried out several products which focus on this dialect.  I had a brief experience with Tus Maith, but wasn't able to form any clear impression of it.  Could you tell me more about your experience with Tus Maith and why you made the recommendation (about contacting Oideas Gael) that you did above? 

Caubeen 

A Chaubeen:

The Tús Maith series is so good because it builds from very basic structures.  It is good "all around" Irish, but shows you

the Ulster Dialect (and the author is from Ulster ).  I met him last year when I took several trips to Derry.  I've made my

way through about 3/4 of the first book, although I have Book 2 & 3.  It gave me enough of a base to enter a university

intermediate Irish course this last semester.  It is inexpensive (30 euro), and has a great CDs and a nice book to go along

with it.

I suppose I just like it because I too was interested in Ulster Irish and this is the most complete learning tool for Ulster (leaning)

Irish that I know of out there.  When I originally called Oideas Gael (cultural school in Donegal ), they recommended it.

Slán

Faber

A Faber,

Thanks for the response.  Would you be able to compare it with "Irish on Your Own" or the new Oideas Gael product "Enjoy Irish".  I have both of these, and have been having good luck with the former.  I am also using (with our little language group that meets weekly) the previous BBC Northern Ireland series Giota Beag and Giota Beag Eile.  They also have been very helpful.  I admit to dabbling with these various products because I haven't found any single one that has everything, but Tus Maith seems to have quite a bit of "heft" (the three volumes), so I guess it covers the field more thoroughly.  Your comments would be most welcome.

Slan

Caubeen

Caubeen:

The Irish on Your Own and Enjoy Irish are both great little resources.  I went to an immersion day in Dallas, and I got a CD of he Irish on Your Own and I listen to it quite often in my car.  I would love to have the work book that goes with it, but don't know where you'd get it.  The Giota Beag is great to learn a few phrases. I met the author and voice actor of it last year in Derry, and he was a really nice guy.  I would use all of the resources if they help you.  I haven't found any one single resource that "get's me there".  It is a very difficult language and anything that helps you is good.  The Tús Maith is greater in depth than all of those and gives some building blocks.  I enrolled in a Universitycourse about 6 weeks ago, and I've learned more Irish than in the last 1.1/2 years.  I have to drive almost 175 miles round trip so it really is difficult, butI'm enjoying the progress.  The language is the hardest language I have ever studied.  The nuances of pronunciation are extremely difficult.  I could not even hear them when I listened to any of the resources we've talked about here.  I can hear them when my teacher speaks to us in the classroom, but I have great difficulty mimicking them.  It seems to me that the Ulster Irish is a bit easier to pronounce than the southern Irish the way she speaks it.   My professor is a 25 year old native speaking woman whose father is from the south and her mother is from the north so she always takes the time to give me the Ulster way of saying things. 

I learned Spanish when I was 17 years old.  I am a fluent speaker.  I learned the basic language by immersion in 3 months and was extremely conversational by then. I am now 55 years old, and can't go live somewhere for 3 months with a family.  So, I must content myself with knowing that I know more Irish than when I started, and that I can chip away at it for years, and enjoy the fact that I am treasuring something of my heritage.  Maybe in time I will be able to become conversational, but the language is so different in its structure, spelling, pronunciation, etc. that I have had to throttle back my expectations and I am becoming okay with it.  I find these forums somewhat counter productive. When I have tried to just put together a few basic thoughts, I  get answered by many with a grammar lesson, so there has a real "chilling" effect on learners.  I've gotten those responses right here.  If we all want to make Irish a part of our lives then we need to become comfortable to step out and use what we know without being shot down.   On Daltai, there are several members that are absolutely wonderful to answer you at your level (Aonghus, Brid, and others).  But there are several others that will come right out and insult you, so I read the forum but rarely post.  

I don't know where you live, but do anything you can to get the most advanced speaker somewhere or a conversational speaker to help your little group.  Don't worry about staying pure in your dialect....just learn the language and speak it to each other.  You can start speaking it by having tea, coffee, food together, and just talking about it.  "Ar mhaith leat tae?  Ba mhait.  Bainne agus siucra le do thoil.  Is fearr liom caife mar go bhfuil 'caffeine' morán ag an caife.  Ar mhaith leat brioscai?......so on and so forth.  That's stuff you can get from all of the resources you've mentioned.  I guess what I'm really trying to say is......

Bí muid caint sa gaeilge!

Let's just talk Irish!

A Faber,

Thanks much again for getting back to me.  I live in Maine, which is in some ways a bit like Texas (it is as big as the other 5 New England states put together), but has a relatively small population (1.3 million), so people and places tend to be spread out a lot.  I travel about 180 miles roundtrip to my little Gaelic group, and I hate the drive (winter driving at night in Maine can be exciting!), but when I get there, I get motivated by the group session.  I always said that if I agree to drive so far for these classes, I had better get something out of them, and I think this has helped motivate me to learn more.

My interest is Ulster Irish is twofold.  My background is from Ulster, so it is a natural sound to me.  Also, I am interested in learning enough Scottish Gaelic (Gaidhlig) to be able to speak a little bit when/if I go up to Nova Scotia (especially Cape Breton)or over to Scotland (the Highlands and Islands), so I am told Ulster Irish will be the most helpful in that regard. 

It is a tough enough slog to learn this language without getting abuse from others.  I'm sorry this has happened to you.  I take most of the input I get as well-meaning and try to learn from it.  Some folks are probably better at giving advice than others.

It is very hard to get learners like us to actually speak the language, and in our classes we have had a tough time getting it to happen.  However, this year we have started doing little presentations (about 5 brief sentences) about ourselves at each class, and this has broken the ice very well.  Not everyone seems to have the same ability to absorb the sounds and repeat them, but I am optimistic that all of us who try it will do better.  We started out using Ulster Irish materials (the Giota Beag lessons), but are now also using Buntus Cainte and Progress in Irish, so we have exposure to the several dialects.  I find the audio of the Buntus Cainte difficult to hear accurately, and I have been happy to have discovered that Raidio Failte (raidiofailte.com) has a learners class (called Cupla Focal) that presents Buntus Cainte in Ulster Irish.  I find it easier to understand, and they present each class twice, slowly, so more of it sinks in.  Unfortunately, the Ulster Irish version is not available commercially, but Raidio Failte says they will be making podcasts of each lesson available in the near future. 

It sounds like you have already progressed beyond the Buntus-Giota Beag Eile level, so I congratulate you.  I will give some more thought to purchasing the Tus Maith materials, but I must admit that I haven't absorbed much of the material in the various courses and books I already have, so may hold off adding any more for a while.  I can do the level of the "coffee, tea, sugar, biscuit" etc. that you mention, but the verbs are much more scary.  I have the Glance Card (and the instructions), but so far haven't gotten a great deal of confidence from it.  I am retired, so the thought of an immersion, perhaps in Donegal, is appealing.  Probably not this year, but perhaps next year.  

If I can be of help to you in any way, please let me know.

Caubeen 

I would be happy to read through the Glance Card with you to give you an idea of what I think is sounds like.  You can reach me at 936-825-1227.  Evenings are best for me.  I'd love to know at what time Raidio Failte has the Ulster Irish Buntus Caint.  Maybe we can talk over the weekend.  I too am retired, so I have a bit of spare time.

Slán

Faber McMullen

hi

"Hi" thusa féin.